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Joshua Chalifour @jc

Pushing scholarly toward a 100% model. aeon.co/ideas/scholarly-publis

This Aeon article includes discussion on improving the way peer review, etc. works. The author (Tennant) says" "All of the technology and traits to build a hybridised scholarly commons infrastructure already exists. It is up to academic communities themselves to step away from their apathy and towards a fairer and more democratic system for sharing our knowledge and work."

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@jc I'm sympathetic to the ideals of the movement, however, I'm pessimistic about "bottom-up" modes of activism in this area

I find that so much "open science" activism is just: shaming early career scientists, and saying sentences that begin with "if everyone would just ..."

If he were proposing the legal abolition of copyright on academic work, now *that* would be something else

@bgcarlisle yeah, it seems there are a bunch of difficulties—often institutional problems in not recognizing the merit of various non-traditional modes of publishing. I'm remembering a discussion where a tenured scientist mentioned how much she pushes back to ensure that her work is open access but that newer researchers have less leeway. A lot of innovative new things could happen but I think we need to figure out how to improve the institutional perspective to get to those. (1/2)

@bgcarlisle Also, I'm not certain that copyright is at the heart of the problem. Creative Commons licences require copyright to work and they extend a variety of use cases that wouldn't otherwise exist. More importantly, how would Moral Right fare without copyright? (2/2)

@bgcarlisle Oh, and I don't mean to say that copyright isn't a problem either. :-)

@jc I mean, how could copyright not be at the heart of the problem?

If the laws protecting scientific published work were taken down, literally all of science would instantly become open access

I'm all for shaking up the system

But if we're gonna do it, let's actually do it, and not just nag people about it

@jc Potential objection: "But without copyright, academic journals will die!"

@bgcarlisle I see that CWs also have an effective use in proper timing for comedy 😃

@bgcarlisle thinking "out loud" if no copyright for scientific work, what would happen in this scenario? 3 researchers finish an important project and disseminate their results (via whatever publishing mechanism). Suppose 2 of them omit all mention of the 3rd. Aside from unfairness, that would close off information from the community because a key researcher would be silenced. Since I understand that attribution is among the moral rights in copyright law, I guess there wouldn't be much recourse.

@jc The law doesn't compel attribution, though

Source: I was very flagrantly plagiarised and neither the journal, nor the "author," nor even the Committee on Publication Ethics, nor my home institution, nor the institution of the prof who stole my work felt compelled to do anything about it

@jc Or maybe I'm wrong about that? (Very possible, I'm an ethicist, not a lawyer)

But even if the law does compel attribution, I feel like that could be legislated separately

@bgcarlisle I was pretty certain that it did, I'm going to find out for sure. But let's say there's no copyright and we then get a different law to govern moral rights, wouldn't we essentially be where we are now through Creative Commons licences? They let you separate the commercial component from copyright and keep the moral rights.

@jc The difference would be:

1. Authors/journals wouldn't have the option of keeping their work under copyright, unlike the current system
2. Previously published work would also no longer be protected, unlike the current system, which requires authors to opt-in
3. Researchers won't have to spend money for an "open access fee," since journals won't have a legal way to stop authors/libraries/sci-hub from just posting papers online

@bgcarlisle I'm partial to the idea that info in the public space be transferable/copyable without restriction (assuming moral rights/attribution remain). It'd change how people view/are able to commercialize much, in extreme ways. I imagine that taking this beyond scientific work, to other research and creative domains would require serious change in society. Extending rights on intangible stuff (e.g. digital info) to logical extremes, eventually brings us to our own minds, which must be free.

@jc I'm just utterly unimpressed at how academic corporations have manipulated the machinery of public policy to give us: worse access to science (not all articles are :oa:), moral condemnation for failing to publish as :oa:, and also attach an :oa: fee, getting the public to pay for them to waive the rights that public institutions granted them in the first place

@bgcarlisle that sounds like a pretty awful failing from the whole system.

@jc Sorry, that link is blank without scripts! I wonder how they propose to deal with authors and editors without a university paying for them to write/edit/copyedit/layout/print.

@bookandswordblog @jc The article offhandedly mentions the possibility of redirecting university library budgets, but it would have been better to give examples of where this already happens: publishing.umich.edu/journals/

The reason it doesn't is possibly that the author is criticising the journal system as a whole.

A lot of authorial and editorial work in academia isn't paid by publishers anyway.

@GardenOfForkingPaths @jc Ok. Me, I like journals (=especially= in fields of scholarship without a home at the university!), I just want to make my research available to as many interested people as possible for as long as possible.

@GardenOfForkingPaths @bookandswordblog the author does seem to want an entirely different system and proposes some ideas of how that could work but I don't see why that would have to be the only way. Thanks for the link example.